Episode 1: Fathers, Sons, and the Journey Home

In the inaugural episode of the Men's Healing Network Podcast, Vincent Perez sits down with educator and Journeyman Institute co-founder Alex Craighead and his father, retired hospice chaplain and Episcopal priest Tom Craighead.

Released on Father's Day, this conversation explores what men's healing looks like across generations. Together, they reflect on childhood wounds, community, rites of passage, vulnerability, purpose, service, and the lifelong journey of becoming more fully human.

Tom shares how stillness, deep listening, and authentic community helped him move from living primarily in his head to reconnecting with his heart. Alex discusses his work guiding young men through rites of passage, the importance of helping boys discover their gifts, and why healing requires the courage to look honestly at ourselves.

Along the way, they explore:

• Why healing is not a destination but an ongoing practice 
• The role of fathers, mentors, and elders in men's lives 
• How community can become medicine for isolation 
• The importance of rites of passage and intentional transitions into adulthood 
• Learning to embrace vulnerability and emotional honesty 
• Service as a path toward meaning and fulfillment 
• The gifts each of us carries and how those gifts serve our communities 
• Why play, connection, and belonging matter at every age 

This episode is a powerful reminder that healing happens in relationship—and that none of us are meant to do it alone. 

Memorable Moments

• Tom reflects on discovering authentic community later in life and learning to bring his head, heart, and actions into alignment. 
• Alex shares the story of his wilderness vision quest and the realization that he didn't need to find a gift for his people—he was the gift. 
• A moving reflection on Alex's mother's response to a cancer diagnosis and the healing power of playfulness in the face of hardship. 
• A candid discussion about masculinity, emotional suppression, and the need for spaces where men can tell the truth about their lives. 

Key Quote

"You are the gift. What are your gifts for your people?" 

About the Guests

Alex Craighead is an educator, mentor, and co-founder of Journeyman Institute, where he helps guide young men through rites of passage, mentorship, and transformative learning experiences. For more than two decades, he has dedicated his work to helping young people discover their gifts, find purpose, and build meaningful community.

Tom Craighead is a retired hospice chaplain and Episcopal priest whose life's work has centered on listening, service, spiritual care, and helping people navigate life's most meaningful transitions. 

Connect with Men's Healing Network

The Men's Healing Network Podcast explores what healing means through conversations between men whose lives have shaped one another. Each episode invites listeners into authentic dialogue about purpose, grief, fatherhood, belonging, community, and what it means to become more fully human.

If this conversation resonates with you, share it with a father, son, brother, mentor, or friend. Someone may be waiting for exactly this invitation. Learn more at MHN.Life.

Transcript

Vincent Perez: 0:07

Welcome to the very first episode of the Men's Healing Network podcast. I'm Vincent Perez, and I'm truly grateful that you are here. This podcast was born from a simple belief that healing happens in relationship. It happens through conversation, through honest reflection, through story, through community. Over the years, I've had the privilege of working with young people, educators, community leaders, fathers, sons, and men from many different walks of life. Again and again, I've seen what becomes possible when people are given space to tell the truth about their lives, to listen deeply, and to be seen without judgment. The Men's Healing Network podcast is an invitation into those kinds of conversations. In each episode, I'll sit down with a guest and ask them to invite another man who has played a meaningful role in their life. Together, we'll explore a simple but powerful question: What does men's healing mean to you? The answers are never the same. Sometimes we'll talk about fatherhood, sometimes grief, sometimes friendship, purpose, community, love, loss, or belonging. But underneath all of it is a shared exploration of what it means to be fully human. I can't think of a more fitting conversation for our first episode and for Father's Day than the one you are about to hear. Today, I'm joined by Alex Craighead and his father, Tom Craighead. Alex is an educator, mentor, and co-founder of Journeyman Institute, where he helps guide young men through meaningful rites of passage and transformative learning experiences. For more than two decades, he has dedicated his life to helping young people discover their gifts, build community, and step into adulthood with purpose. He invited his father, Tom Craighead, who is a retired hospice chaplain and Episcopal priest whose life has been devoted to service, listening, and helping people navigate life's most meaningful transitions. What unfolds in this conversation is more than a discussion about men's healing. It's a conversation between a father and a son who deeply respect one another. It's a reflection on community, purpose, vulnerability, and what it means to become and remain a wholehearted man. Thank you for joining us for the beginning of this journey. Let's get started I'm filled with such gratitude for this conversation. I invited Alex. I met you at a Men's Healing Network think tank, and you and your colleague Duncan came to my home and really shared about your service with Journey Men. I'm particularly, struck by your commitment to young men as we come up, right? So I had once heard a, a mentor of mine said, "We're, we're growing trees, not carrots." And so the investment that you're putting in that time to grow kind of robust roots and, think about a full lifetime, that just fills me with, with such, um, gratitude to even know thank you so much for being here, Alex. I wanna start out with your invitation, and tell us why you invited your father.

Alex Craighead: 3:12

Thanks, Vincent, for having us. I'm grateful to be here today and been looking forward to this conversation. Yeah, for me, in, in receiving your invitation, I first felt honored, and when you mentioned, the invitation to bring a man that has had a significant impact in my life, and in my own journey of becoming a stand-up, wholehearted man, I couldn't think of anyone else that came to mind aside from my dad. And I recognize that I'm incredibly blessed. I actually just a couple days ago was talking with one of my best friends, and he acknowledged, like, "I don't think that many people are as close with their dads or-- as you are with your father." And it just was that, a simple little reminder for me of how blessed I am to have such a good relationship with my dad and, and the role that he set for me as becoming a good man. So I'm stoked to have him on the call today and to get to have this conversation, all three of us.

Vincent Perez: 4:03

Thank you. So Tom, my first question for you in thinking about your, uh, influence here in this room especially, the big question we're asking is, what does men's healing mean to you?

Tom Craighead: 4:14

Thank you, Vincent. I think that, much of my life, I would've answered your question, beyond the narrower frame of men's healing and, talked universally about human healing. that's been a focus of mine for decades. And I'll start with that and hopefully zero in on the men's part by the time I'm done. I think, there was some wounding, in my childhood, family of origin, that, was particular to me but not that unusual in people's lives, that I've heard about. And, that needed tending, and it, got to a point where the, emptiness and the pain, was such that I couldn't avoid it any further. a variety responses were required. I needed to learn how to manage, the self that I was, and how to kind of control some of the strong emotions that, got the better of me, and, find, ways to soothe myself and, and calm and, and balance myself. and I think later on as I settled down and, kind of began to find my path, I realized that, I needed authentic community, that I had not had that, a village as some would call it, in my upbringing really. We were a very transient family and, I didn't have much extended family. it was only actually by midlife that I really began to discover and celebrate community, and in that came some of the most substantive, healing really, as found out, what my gifts really were, without all the, pretend roles that I, uh, adopted through my earlier I think, the emotional maturing, was how I would respond to the question about men's healing. I, I was living in my head primarily for the first 40 years of my life. I didn't know how to access my heart. I didn't know what that meant. And so I would say that that's probably the biggest single arena to answer, your question about healing as a man, that I needed to bring together my head and my heart, and my actions

Vincent Perez: 6:33

Thank you. I really appreciate how you hold and lift both healing and gifts. You mentioned that together. and the universality of this human experience and what healing means. But I do also see the significance of you're in your midlife and we're finally accessing the heart, right? There's, I think there's so much pitted against that, that possibility even, or the practice or, uh, the way. And so I'm curious for you, Alex, you know, what resonates from your, your father's answer and, and what's your own answer to what does men's healing mean to

Alex Craighead: 7:12

Thanks, Vincent. I would say for me, the concept of men's healing wasn't even something on my radar for my adolescence, for my young adulthood. and it wasn't until I started noticing patterns in other people that I started to have the courage to look in the mirror and also do some work with myself. so I'll share just a little bit of the context that led me to, working with men and young men. I have a history as an educator. I got my master's degree in teaching and taught elementary school. I taught high school, in all sorts of places. I was, in international school in Germany. I've taught in, inner city like San Francisco, at youth detention facilities, more rural communities, so a wide range of youth in America and beyond. And after, nearly 10 years of being an educator, I really started to see some patterns with my boy students. and at that youth detention facility that I was working, it was a co-ed facility, but it was 90% boys and young men. And I was around that same time I started to connect some dots. There was a string of youth suicides in our hometown community, mostly of young men. there was tragic stories of sexual assault and harm to some of the closest women in my life by men in their lives. and then really noticing these patterns of like school shootings and some of the other violent patterns in America largely predominated by men and young men. And so my best friend and I started to connect these dots and realized that there's a huge issue with the masculine right now hurting or being hurt. and so really explored what can we do about this. So about 10 years ago, we decided to go upstream and really strive to work with boys and young men and help them connect with their hearts, help them, find a sense of belonging with a loving and supportive community, help them identify their gifts and find purpose in life to be able to contribute and give back, and create a vision for their future so they feel motivated to, to keep going. and also to walk with reverence and respect and empathy for others. so that started my work with boys and young men, and in that same vein, I realized very quickly, like I have to walk the talk. I have to be a man of integrity. I have to do my own work. I have to be somebody that has looked honestly in the mirror and faced my own shadows if I'm gonna be a role model for these boys and encouraging them to do the same. So that was about 27 years old when I started, Journey Men, and that was also the same time that I really started doing my own more intentional healing work that showed up in various ways. But ultimately for me, it looked like, uncovering and unearthing some patterns, beliefs, and wounds that I had from middle school, from even elementary school, from high school, that I had just buried. I had totally forgotten. I had put them out of sight, out of mind. but it wasn't until I started spending some intentional time with myself this realm of healing that I realized, oh, there's still some things that are driving the bus for me, some old shame that I had buried, some unconscious patterns and habits that, prevented me from being my best self, but also from living fully and, feeling a sense of unconditional love for myself. so it really, I think for me, it was also unlearning, conditioning that I had grown up with, and not from my dad per se, but just from our culture, from our peers, from our social media, from video games, from media like TV and sports around tough it up, man up, don't cry. so I remember previously, like I had been hurt in sports, and if I would cry, like I had coaches kinda, tell us to tough it up or throw us back in the game even though we had a broken bone and thought we were faking it. so for a long time, like I just started to neglect my pain, physical and emotional, and just bury it and try and be tough and try and be cool and not let people see that vulnerable side of me. So part of my healing was just also becoming okay with my tears, and now I don't hide my tears. I don't like cover my face if I'm crying, like I'm not ashamed to cry in front of people, and that has been a part of my healing journey too, to be okay being tender, being vulnerable, in a place where I need to ask for support and ask for help, which I previously didn't used to do

Vincent Perez: 11:20

Thank you. You both mentioned accessing this inner world, right? And, being okay with it, but there's a depth there. So I'm curious, Tom, kind of a two-parter here. What did you witness in your son in that access, and how did you yourself… Was there a moment in your life when something, someone, a teacher, what, what happened to open you up and where you get to kind of map and explore your own inner kind of emotional ecosystem?

Tom Craighead: 11:49

I'll start with myself. first off, I, think, in my 20s, I had, gotten kinda wild and was abusing substances a lot, to the point where I was scaring myself. so I moved to an island off the coast of Maine and lived alone for a year, and that was kind of the beginning of going inside and just being comfortable with silence and, inner reflection. and a spiritual life gradually took hold there as well, that has stayed with me ever another event, much later, uh, probably around 50, I was in a, workshop and, had been assigned a sculpting assignment that, we were supposed to just freeform it and come up with something, whatever our hands wanted to create, which is not something I'm gifted in. And, I found myself, creating this, androgynous human figure with its arms open, leaning back in just this open, receptive, jubilant kind of a posture. I realized that that was me, for one thing, and, tapping into something that I wasn't familiar with terribly. and the more I thought about it, I realized that also was kind of a whole new way of, experiencing God for myself, And that I had been, without even knowing it, afraid of God, and God's judgment, God's punishment or whatever, totally unconscious, and, that this was a whole new part of me that was within that I could enjoy and, uh, be fed by as far as for Alex, I've watched, you know, the young 20-year-old, braggadocio or whatever the word is. he was a good athlete. He, uh, was popular, and he knew a lot. it was sometimes a little much, honestly. it was a slow, subtle process for his mother and me to watch him, tap into his inner world. I think, there were a couple of particular, uh, setbacks that sort of jolted his world, and helped him to look further inside. and he can talk about that if he wants to. But, I think, he just, he found it on his own. It wasn't like anybody was prescribing something to him. he seemed to know that there was more, and he listened, and he followed that, thread

Vincent Perez: 14:06

I'm hearing a, balance here, both exploration of inner world, self-love, self-acceptance, right, in that process. Both of you in your 20s not really figuring it out. And so I'm curious, Alex, what resonates with you in your father's responses, but also, in your work serving younger men with this theme of like, "Eh, is our 20s really got it? I don't know." You know? And the maturation kind of starts hitting in our 30s and 40s. how do you kind of connect that knowing there's gonna be these turbulent times, but you're already kind of equipping younger boys? I'm curious like what their life trajectories will be, with those early interventions.

Alex Craighead: 14:46

one of the many things that I feel like my dad's story and mine has in common was, the era of our 20s and substances and sometimes some reckless behavior, struggling with self-love and a sense of direction. Both of those, I think, were true in different ways within our 20s. And one of the things that, our work focuses on through Journeymen is rites of passage work, and intentionally offering initiatory experiences for young adults to have a meaningful life transition stepping into young adulthood. And so the reason I bring that up is because for thousands of years, cultures around the world have offered intentional ceremonies and rites of passage for the young people in their communities and their villages to step into adulthood and to welcome them into the community of adults in a way that is done with intentionality, with, sacred ritual, but also with an honoring of who these young people are, for their gifts, for their, their place in the village. And my dad and I did not have that. Most people in Western society do not have that. our culture has kind of lost these practices, and because of that, through our teachings and through the l- the learning that we've done over the years of reading from different, anthropologists and, mythologists, is that with the loss of rites of passage is that what happens is a lot of people, I think my dad myself included, come of age, they step into adulthood, and now they're in adult male bodies, but they haven't shifted their mindset or their heart to be oriented towards a healthy and mature adult. So they're still kind of operating on this boy psychology. They're still operating in this narcissistic sometimes or me-centered worldview that's really thinking about my own problems, my challenges, my pain, my wealth or abundance, like my relationships. It's really just kind of solely focused on like what's best for me. And in healthy adulthood, my understanding and belief is that they're zooming out and considering what's good for the whole. How can I be of service? How can I contribute to my family, to my school, or to my community? What are my gifts, and how can I help those be of service to others? and then particularly, what parts of myself, my boy behaviors or my teenage behaviors, what parts are no longer serving me? what am I ready to let go of? Like shedding skin like a snake, right? Like we can have a death without dying, symbolic death of this boy or a symbolic death of these old childish behaviors and letting them go and letting them die and stepping into a new, healthier, more mature version of ourselves to really be, grown-ups, uh, and not just in the body, but in the heart and the mind and the soul as well. So for me, our work largely is really striving to go upstream with teenagers and helping them provide these experiences so that they can have some of those aha moments. They can move through some of the stuff that is keeping them, holding them back or feeling like they're stuck in a time during 17, 16, 18 years old, and really step fully into adulthood in a way that they're seen and honored and excited for the next chapter of their life. And will that make it easy? No. There's still gonna be hardship. There's still gonna be turbulence and challenges ahead, but they're gonna have a better sense of who they are, what their values are, what their gifts are, who their support system are when they, can turn to when they need help. as my dad mentioned, he didn't really feel like he had a village, and I did, but I I feel like because of a lot of the conditioning in our culture, I, buried a lot of that, and I didn't know how to talk about certain things. I didn't know how to open up about certain things or ask for help on certain things. I thought I just had to figure it out on my own. I believe that trying to offer these types of experiences or healing spaces where we can be vulnerable and share our hearts and our questions and our fears, that allows us show up more fully and to do this together rather than the stoic kind of individual man that we often touting in America as what it means to be a successful man today.

Vincent Perez: 18:52

You know, I'm hearing both, about this village you're both kind of speaking to. and you specifically said a place in the village, and I've also heard this referred to as like your post, which really gets at purpose, right? What is the meaning for our existence of why am I here? only recently for me have I discovered I am here, and I want, wanted a bold language, and I was s- supported in, in expressing this bold language. I am here on this planet, I, in this existence to create and serve sacred learning communities, and that's what came for me. And so I think a lot about that community aspect. I came up Catholic, and even as I think about the rites of passage there with confirmation, there was still something very kind of it's your world in that for me. I didn't feel part of a fuller community. Um, I found a bit of a post. I was a lector and Eucharistic minister, and this is still late high school, early college. eventually I strayed from that path. Uh, I had a monsignor tell me. He said, specifically he gave me this wood carved crucifix. He said, "You're gonna go to college, and you're gonna read, and you're gonna leave the faith." And it's exactly what occurred because I was a seeker. He knew I was a seeker and searching these other truths. So I'm curious, Tom, for you, and then for Alex, the same question. What was it in the village? What communities really opened you up to connect with both yourself and others in a more authentic way?

Tom Craighead: 20:17

I spent a fair bit of my m- middle part of my life, professionally in the church. that was community, but, in retrospect it, it was institutional. It was, official role in my case, being ordained and, Yeah, it just didn't go deep in ways that later I would appreciate, once I was out of the church. I don't wanna disparage the church. It was important for me at that time, and, um, it was part of my path, and I, I'm grateful for it. But, since then, community, has had a lot to do with settling for me. I mentioned the transience of my youth. we were a military family, and, I never lived anywhere more than six years until I was well into my 50s. here now we're 30-plus years in the same community, that, has been an important context for me to finally, slow down enough and figure out who's around me and how do I want to relate with them and, get the support I, I need. it's been organic. It's not been institutional. I, I've had, affinity groups that have just formed, of their own, voluntarily and, sort of open-ended so that there's no lock-in kind of a commitment, to meeting, you know, once a week or once a month or whatever, just to support one another. I've got two or three of those that, have gone on for several years now and, it's in that kind of a rhythm, from several different directions that, that I've been able to find and celebrate community,

Vincent Perez: 21:53

How about for you, Alex?

Alex Craighead: 21:54

a few of my favorites for, building the village and feeling like I'm part of it are simple and time-tested, which is play. I love to play, and I feel like intentional play or just unstructured free play with people really helps me connect and builds community very quickly. breaking bread together, making meals, and, eating food together has really also, just helped me feel like connected with people, and it feels like it's the oldest way to, to build community from time immemorial is like breaking bread around the table. and another one that came to mind for me, which is really central to the work that we do, but also, a big part of my own healing journey as a man is the sitting in circle together. And a lot of people that don't sit in s- like have done, never done a circle before don't really understand why. Why is that significant? Okay, you just sit in a circle and you talk. But there's something so powerful in its simplicity. And so for me, it's often around a fire, intergenerational, so you got youth and middle-aged folks and elders. but it's really, it's not banter. It's not talking about the Seahawks. It's not, sports betting. it's very authentic, heart-centered communication where we can talk about what's real in our lives. We can talk about how we're feeling, which that alone sometimes is an edge for some boys and men. but then diving into different topics that are so rich and, and juicy to talk about with a group of people that are figuring this thing out of life together. conversations everything from like love and rejection to, death and loss and grief or accountability or our mental health. Like, different things that we're all navigating at some point in our lives, but sometimes it feels too taboo to talk about or maybe too vulnerable to talk about. But doing so in a circle where everybody's just sharing honestly, it kinda gives permission for everybody to do the same. It allows one to find their voice. It allows people to be seen authentically for who they are, which I believe is a human need. and to not feel alone in that because now I'm hearing other people talk about their questions of different things or their challenges in these themes, and all of a sudden I'm like, "Ah, okay," like I'm not alone in thinking I'm not enough, or I'm not alone in thinking like I'm too skinny and I'm not strong enough. Like, there's this normalization of my experience when I hear other people's experience, and it has… It's almost like therapeutic in nature. and the last thing that I wanted to identify for me, which has been really healing and, affirming and feeling like I belong in the village and like I'm seen and welcomed here, is this process of honoring. and so we do this, and, and this is something that has been infused into rites of passage work for thousands of years. it's really acknowledging and celebrating the gifts of each person that is having their rite of passage experience. So the gifts is like really the inner gifts. And so I remember on my own vision quest, my rite of passage, I was 27 years old, and four days fasting in the wilderness by myself, and they encouraged us to think about a few things, one each day. And on the third day, they asked us to think about what are your gifts for your people? And I remember I'm in this high desert. I'm like, it's, Three Sisters, Oregon, kinda thing, and I'm looking through the high desert like trying to find something that I can gift my family. Like beautiful stones or maybe I can like carve some wood piece or something like that for my family. Like, oh, I need to find gifts for my people. And I was getting frustrated 'cause it's in the high desert, and there was, like, nothing to find that seemed gift-worthy. And I was just kind of beating myself up, and then I had this light bulb moment where I started laughing at myself in the desert, and I realized, I was like, "Wait a minute, you idiot." Like, "You're the gift. You don't, you don't need to bring them stones or some carved wood or a necklace." Like, "You are the gift for your people. What are you bringing back?" Like,"What are your gifts, like, in here?" And I was like, "Oh, no shit. I totally misunderstood the prompt." Uh, but it was just like, it was like dun, dun, dun. I'm like, "That's what I've been missing for so long," was like I am-- I have gifts. I am a gift. Like, I don't need this. I don't need that. I don't need to find all these things to be worthy or to be enough. It's like I am enough. I am the gift, and so what am I bringing? And that was just like, it really opened things up for me because I just went back to my notebook after having that aha moment, and I wrote pages, pages of things. And I'm like, "I'm this. I am this. I am this." Like, "I have so many gifts. Wow, I have so many gifts to bring to the village." And I share that because when you don't love yourself and when you don't feel like you have gifts, you don't feel like you have something to contribute to this village where you see all these other people, these musicians, and these actors, and these builders, and these carpenters or these mechanics or all these successful people, and you look at them and you think, "Wow, they're all so good, but I have nothing. I'm worthless." Like,"What can I contribute? I just, I'm… I don't know." But once you start being honored for your gifts and celebrated for your gifts, it's, it can be empowering, but it also can be like, "Oh, yes. Okay, I have a way to give back. I have something to offer. I also belong here, and am needed here." so it's a really empowering thing that I feel like we so often focus on the deficits of people. So for me, one of the other things of building village is, like, really celebrating what we see in one another, the beauty and the gifts within one another, to like-- because I think what we water grows. then people are just gonna feel more welcomed and more encouraged to participate and be engaged in the community when they feel truly seen and honored.

Vincent Perez: 27:28

That's a beautiful story. Thank you so much. Both of your responses have place, right? It's about place, even being around the fire, being outside among the natural world is where answers are coming and you're connecting more with self. Um, and yeah, I just come back to place. Like it matters so, so much, for our wellbeing, and I'm not alone.

Alex Craighead: 27:52

Mhm.

Vincent Perez: 27:53

I think that goes so, so far when we realize that, embody that. What does that really mean? I'm, I'm not alone. I'm coming to a question that I think kind of really has landed for me for life, which is how do you deal with hardship? I think that one question is the answer to everything. even when I think about public education, does it prepare our young people to deal with life's hardships that they're gonna face, right? I, I apply this in so many aspects of my world. I've served at the state juvenile, prison here in Washington for 12 years. and inviting even that practice in how do we deal with hardship, well, we go into community, we go into ritual. the sweat lodge in, in particular, the Temazcal, has been really influential in my life in holding us in the womb of Mother Earth, right? As that metaphor. And we, and we leave together as siblings, really deeply connected. And so, this is actually a real kind of personal question for both of you. Tom, I wanna start with you, is what are your gifts? Like permission to brag, right? And celebrate a little bit, and how have you used those to deal with life's hardships?

Tom Craighead: 29:00

would say that, We had this joke, my nickname amongst the journeyman community is still Tom. and I won't go into why that's a joke. But, the stillness, is apt, I think. There is a, an inner calm and, peace about my spirit that, maybe I was born with it, it's become more manifest as I've aged. And, along with a fair bit of training, have cultivated the other gift that goes along with it, which is, I'm a good listener that was the heart of my vocational path, through my earning years, listening at a deep level, to through hospice work, actually, speaking of hardships. Those both, uh, have personally served me, when hardship has knocked on my door. in particular, the threat of, loss, when serious illness has struck people I love. I find, consolation, and, grounding and, stabilizing, rebalancing, soothing, on and on. I, I feel fed eventually, and encouraged, that would be the maybe means more than anything else. entering into my own stillness and listening deeply within for spirit to speak, that's, that's where I start. and I would agree with you that the community, is essential. and I have to turn to that. I think I'm, I'm apt to go first, inside myself.

Vincent Perez: 30:34

Thank you so much. Alex, before you respond for your answer, I'm curious, is there anything you wanna celebrate or what resonates about your father's answer?

Alex Craighead: 30:42

thanks Vincent. I would say that it feels spot on. Still Tom is-- brought me a smile just thinking about that moment where that nickname came up in circle with a bunch of middle school boys in an intro rites of passage work, and, and the blessing of getting to do sacred work with my dad and with the youth in our village, like what a blessing. and that stillness is something that I've long admired, and at times gotten frustrated with when I was impatient as a teenager. But, as my parents age, I find myself really striving to, be mindful of like what I truly admire in them and like integrate the qualities that I look up to in them and that I wanna carry forward, in my life. that, that inner peace that my dad walks with and the willingness to listen both to his own world, to God or spirit, and then also to be present fully with others, is something that I've long, uh, admired and I feel like is the reason why there's countless people that turn to him in their moments of hardship, because they feel, A, that he can hold space for that, that he's a deep and genuine listener, but that he'll also honor confidentiality in that he doesn't go running around telling people stuff, so you can trust him with his and that to me has been, I think, a quality that he didn't name tonight, today that feels like really, foundational for who he is as a man. Like, you can trust Tom

Vincent Perez: 32:08

And for you? Your gifts?

Alex Craighead: 32:09

it's funny to, focus so much on gifts and, and really try and uplift and, celebrate them in others. But for me, like, to try and articulate it, I haven't quite distilled it to be like it's this and it's this. I'll try briefly to-- Like three things came to mind for me. One is I'm a very gifted connector, in helping, A, connecting with people, but helping people connect and building community and, experiences where people genuinely connect and authentically connect. So that's one of my gifts, is bringing people together. Another one is my loving, open heart. I feel like I have access to this abundant well of love, and I believe love is the most powerful force on the planet, and so I try and s-share it widely and also cultivate it as best I and then the last one that comes to mind for me is, like, my playful spirit. I love to play, and I feel like that's medicine that I share with the world. and I'll start with the play in terms of how it's helped me through challenge and share a brief story about my mom. Dad, you've heard this story, but, about 10 years ago, maybe a little more, she got diagnosed with pretty aggressive, breast cancer, and her chances of survival were not, like, high. and when she told me that, I was at class in college, and I'd stepped out to hear the, to talk with her, to hear what's going on. and she shared about her cancer diagnosis, and I just started bawling and crying and, like, so concerned and not ready to lose my mom. and she was just like,"Alex, it's, it's okay. I'm gonna have fun with this." And I'm like, did you-- Are you, are you okay? Like, what do you mean you're gonna have fun with this?" And she says, "Well, you know, I'm gonna lose my hair from chemo, so I've been looking at, like, purple wigs on Amazon, and I've got all sorts of fun hats that I never used to wear, so I'm gonna wear those hats. And our neighbors are gonna be bringing meals and my best friend's gonna take me to chemo." And, like, here she's dealt the shittiest deck of cards in her life, and she says, "I'm gonna have fun with this." And fast-forward through her chemo, she beat the odds and she actually, got rid of her cancer and, and made it through. And the c- the doctors, as they were kind of analyzing things and the tests and her outcome, were, like, really celebrating and acknowledging that a big part of what they believe led her to, to getting back to full health was her mindset and her attitude through this. So, like, shit's gonna happen, right? Things are gonna go bad in our lives. We're gonna have hardship. But how we respond is up to us, and it can make a world of difference. So by my mom staying positive and having a playful attitude through it, like, she was able to navigate that chapter with grace and with levity and ultimately through healing. and talking about, like, really trying to integrate my parents' best qualities, that one was, like, such a potent and powerful lesson that I learned from my mom and I've really tried to carry that forward with me, and it's not always easy. It's not always easy to find the silver lining or to stay optimistic through hardship. I've gone through plenty of hardship in my day, both for my own personal self and then loss and grief through death and tragedy of loved ones. but a willingness to try and be playful through it has been really helpful. and to my dad's piece, that stillness, that's not a gift of mine, but it's important and it's another piece that I cultivate. And I had a 10-day meditation retreat that, has really given me skills and tools to be able to sit in the discomfort and to sit with the pain and to accept it and not run away from and that has been a really profound tool for me to navigate some of the harder things in my life, is to lear- learn how to just really sit with it and be in a place of trust and surrender

Vincent Perez: 35:44

You just gave me this image of this balance of a teeter-totter of play and pain. There's something about that. how do we how do we kind of find that equilibrium? as we close here, for our listeners, I'm curious, Tom, is there anything that's on your heart that you're thinking this is really important, I think, for us to discuss here on this topic

Tom Craighead: 36:06

the word service bubbles up over and over for me. I think that, integrates with the talk about, gifts and, calling or vocation or path. there is something about having given my time and my attention and my and my whatever skills and training I have to another person or a group of people that, evokes A depth of life and, awareness, and just joy that, I don't think I would have otherwise.

Vincent Perez: 36:40

Thank you. Very much resonates with me. How about for you, Alex? Is there anything you feel like we missed or we wanna raise to the surface?

Alex Craighead: 36:48

I'll start with the brief story. we do this journeyman work, mentoring and rites of passage work for boys and teenagers, and simultaneously I was also, a high school lacrosse coach, for our community here. Very different energies, as you could imagine. L- lacrosse culture and then, like, heart-centered, like talking around the fire kind of energy. Very different energies. And I remember after practice one day, I asked one of my players, I said,"You know what?" I was like, "How come you haven't ever, done something with Journeymen?" And he said, "Why would I go to the doctor if I'm not sick?" And that really stuck with me. I said, "Why will I not-- Why would I go to the doctor if I'm not sick?" And the reason I bring that up in this conversation is because it's almost always the moms that sign their boys up for our experiences. It's almost always the moms and the women that see the benefit and the need for this kind of work, and m- many, many men avoid this type of work, avoid a men's circle, avoid an experience that might even be considered as like a healing experience. And I think about that, why would I go to the doctor if I'm not sick? Well, I think a lot of Americans, and probably men around the world, are unaware of the fact that our culture is sick, or maybe not really aware that like they're swimming in some pretty wounded waters. And so it might feel like we're fine. It might feel like, oh, I have nothing to address. But I just… I think our culture is to this place where we've normalized power over behavior. We've normalized the military industrial complex and killing and bombing and, oh, collateral, we might need to lose some women and children for the sake of safety or whatever. Like it's this, this culture of violence and harm has been so normalized, and suppression of emotion and, neglect of an empathetic reality that sees all life as sacred. and so I believe like this kind of work of like tending to our hearts and opening our hearts and finding the humanity in one another and finding the love and reverence for each other is critical in this time where there's so much violence and division, and that all of us get wounded along the way. All of us experience hardship, and thus healing is needed. But we live in a pain-avoidant culture that numbs out through substances or technology or sports betting or, just constantly watching TV and never actually feeling what's going on in here, and then being able to transmute it into some kind of positive change in your life or your community. so I just wanna like encourage anybody that might be hearing this conversation to, to do the thing. heed the call, right? Like if somebody invites you to a thing, give it a try. step outside your comfort zone. Try new experiences. Some of the best experiences I've had in my life have been things I didn't know what to expect. It seemed foreign to me or like new or maybe even a little scary to try. but I just wanna encourage people to like try the things that are inviting you into more wholeness, that are inviting you more fully into community or into yourself it's hard to put words to all that it can open up for us in our lives, from relationships to abundance to just an inner peace. it can also be scary, and I just wanted to name that, that there doesn't have to be anything wrong with you to still benefit from being in these types of healing and, connective spaces

Vincent Perez: 40:19

Thank you so much for that insight. The more I do presentations, in communities, whether it's schools or professionals, and speak about the Men's Healing Network, and that was intentional healing. also discovering that the network is more critical than anything, these connections, these invitations, these touch points. But the question is so striking. Why would I go to the doctor, if I'm well, right? Or this, this perception that I'm well. it is so rich one last question for you, Tom. what would you offer for men who have that question

Tom Craighead: 40:49

I'm assuming that he's even looking at me and, and engaged in a conversation with me for some reason, and it may be that he's seen something or heard something in me that, his interest or attracts him. I think that's, that's been a part of my giftedness as well, is just modeling something that people recognize and, and wanna perhaps, explore themselves. just being sensitive to that, and what I tend to do is bounce it back to the person, the other person. And, I'm pretty good at framing questions that are open-ended and empowering. following the thread that I hear from you, Joe or whoever, you know, "It sounds like you're asking about this. Does that feel right? And, and what would that mean to you?" just kind of teasing it along. but it's his work ultimately. I, I don't preach, I don't prescribe. I just kinda notice and, support and affirm what I see and, identify the next doorway

Vincent Perez: 41:55

All right. With that, I'll think about what am I noticing? what am I inviting? What invitations am I accepting? I think those are really great open, honest questions for us to close on. I'm so, so grateful for your time, for your connection, for your stories. It is a true honor and a blessing, to document this conversation with you all. Thank you so much for being here.

Tom Craighead: 42:17

Thank you, Vincent. Yeah.

Alex Craighead: 42:19

thank you for inviting us and for the work that you do in the world, my friend. I'm grateful to be in community

Vincent Perez: 42:26

Thank you for joining us for this conversation with Alex and Tom Craighead. As I reflect on what we explored today, I keep coming back to a few themes: community, service, vulnerability, and the courage to keep growing. I think that's one of the gifts of this conversation. Neither Alex nor Tom presented healing as something you finish. They described it as an ongoing relationship with yourself, with others, and with life itself. On this Father's Day, I'm especially grateful for the example they offered us, a relationship between a father and a son, not built on perfection, but on presence, curiosity, trust, and love. Those qualities matter. And whether your relationship with your father has been a source of joy or complexity, grief, gratitude, or some combination of all those things, I hope something in today's conversation met you where you are. The Men's Healing Network exists because none of us are meant to do this alone. If this conversation resonated with you, I invite you to share it with someone who might need it, a father, son, a brother, a mentor, friend. And if someone came to mind while you were listening, maybe that's your invitation to reach out. Thank you for being part of this community from the very beginning. The Men's Healing Network podcast is made possible in part through the support of Choice Regional Health Network, whose commitment to community helps make this work possible. Our podcast is produced by Tom Keppeler. Special thanks to Dee Enriquez for her logistical and marketing expertise. Until next time, take good care of yourself, take good care of one another, and keep saying yes to the conversations that help us become more fully human. We'll see you on the next episode of the Men's Healing Network podcast. Blessings to you and yours.